Thorne Peters and his 4/20 “Potcastathon”

I was very much looking forward to a three hour 4/20 show with Thorne Peters on Facebook.

It was going to be about the use of “No Men’s Rae” when pleading a Marijuana case,  and was featuring several guests along with Mary Thomas-Spears of Kentucky for Cannabis who was offering a different view on the use of this plea in a Court of Law, which apparently Mr. Peters did not wish to hear.  However, he DID invite her to his show for her to give her point of view and I knew it would be a good debate … or at least I thought it would be… 

There has been a much heated environment of late concerning “No Men’s Rae”, particularly on Facebook where both Thorne Peters and Mary Thomas Spears reside.  Both are long time Activists.  Mr. Peters is from Tennessee and Ms. Spears, is a long time Kentucky resident.  Both have had a number of legal cases involving Cannabis/Marijuana and are no strangers to the Legal System. 

RELATED:  Is No Men’s Rae “The plea to SET US FREE” ?

 

https://www.facebook.com/plugins/video.php?href=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.facebook.com%2Fthorne.peters%2Fvideos%2F1309776462436029%2F&show_text=1&width=560

I, as well, received an invitation from him.  I am assuming because I wrote the article concerning “No Men’s Rae” about  a week ago.

I invite you onto my 4/20 LIVE POTCAST to call in and talk about activism. I will be on from 4:20 pm ET til 4:20 pm PT 3 hours LIVE!

Thu 1:52pm

Psycho Mary will be calling in.

I replied later that day,

Thu 5:05pm

Need a call in #…. Isn’t Mary supposed to be on the show? At what time? Im listening!!!

Chat Conversation End

I knew as soon as I saw that message from him, and the way he referred to Ms. Spears, that it probably wasn’t going to be a fair debate, but thought maybe that was just his way of being “funny”.

Ms. Spears also speaks slowly and has a very deliberate voice, explaining details as she goes, and tries very hard to tell it in a way that everyone will understand.   When someone deliberately tries to talk over the top of her in a conversation, as he did, she can get very annoyed, understandably.  He purposefully spoke above her and never gave her a chance to fully explain herself, and as well actually made  “fun” of her during the “conversation”, (if you could even call it a conversation).  He had previously during the show used an automated voice of her commenting about “No Men’s Rae”, to which she had no chance to respond.  (Please review video starting at @1:55).

Oh and I finally listened to his broadcast and he sounds like he studied one of my broadcast nearly repeats everything I said only in stead of screaming repeal he is screaming no Mens Rea (Rev. Mary)

https://www.facebook.com/plugins/post.php?href=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.facebook.com%2Fmarythomas.spears%2Fposts%2F654968434600555&width=500

 

Mary Thomas-Spears aka Rev. Mary EITHER IT IS BEING CENSORED OR IGNORED. NEITHER CAN CHANGE THE TRUTH LINK

It suffices to say that I believe that there is no place for this kind of badgering between Activists.  There are a lot of us, we all have differing opinions on a lot of things.  We should not be harassed when being spoken to especially in a public conversation. 

When looking at the comments displayed under the video it seems there where a few with a differing opinion of No Men’s Rae and a few others which were not happy with the way Ms. Spears was treated while a “guest” on his show.

I was very disappointed and I feel it puts a cloud over the issue when a “Host” acts as Mr. Peters did on his show.  Everybody center’s on the ongoing “entertainment” instead of the real issue – the Justice System in this Country.  But then entertainment invites listeners and gets people talking and I’m thinking maybe that was what he was trying to do – use her for entertainment purposes?  I hope that he thinks before being this disrespectful to anyone again!

We will be watching when “No Mens Rae” goes to Court in July!

And yes, I still wish him much luck in his endeavors!

As well, I have much respect for Rev. Mary Thomas-Spears and her opinion.  I have seen years of Activism and teaching as well as actual Court Cases in the  Justice System which she has endured.  She has spent years learning from Activists such as Jack Herer, Gatewood Galbraith,  Ron Kiczenski, Joseph Zoretic as well as educating  Cannabis Activists, including myself, and I have never had her tell me anything that did not prove to be true.

I trust her judgement.

The following is a few excerpts from Facebook Messenger conversations:

Rev. Mary:  His Attack Began on the Comments he left on post on my wall he then starts contacting people on my list I guess to attack me personally… Because then I get this from Jeri Rose…

Jeri Rose:  just got this PM from that man (Thorne Peters), trying Mens R Here is what he wrote: She identifies herself as a psychic. If her victory had any merit, I would not be facing CANNABIS charges and no one else would be arrested…I will accomplish that on July 31, 2017. 750k getting arrested every year, only a brain dead sheeple would declare a legal victory. Getting your own ass off the hook with a begging plea for mercy does none of us any good. Follow the law. NO MENS REA.

Rev. Mary:  At which point I think… Really????That’s what your going to do??? Make personal attacks to my character like a government agent or psych-ops?

Thorne Peters (to Rev. Mary):
I will be reading your take on NO MENS REA from your group post on my LIVE @ 4:20 pm CT POTCAST as a shining example of how even intelligent people can be led astray by flock mentality. Perhaps you should listen to the facts from a court of law. If your position on MENS REA is true, then how come Negroes didn’t follow the laws against them? …

Mary Thomas-Spears:
You are singing to the choir here but your also wrong in your approach
Apr 11
Mary Thomas-Spears:
@Thorne Peters Yes! I know! I already proved that in court = pot is Legal already!
Years ago as you can see by the above!
Problem is, it is still Prohibited by an Unconstitutional CSA!
And you are wrong about how your going about it!
Because of your being out of order…
Order is very important!
I say this to you as someone who has been there and who has been through more from experience in an attempt to help.
Please try to understand that you are contradicting yourself
And they will use it to their advantage because it is what they do
Hear ???

Thorne Peters:
I invite you onto my 4/20 LIVE POTCAST to call in and explain your position. I will be on from 4:20 pm ET til 4:20 pm PT 3 hours LIVE! Call in and set me straight if you are up for it.
Today at 12:11am · Sent from Web

Thorne Peters:
My 35 years as a strip club dj has trained me to win over all audiences . . . my charming wit is undeniable. My deviant style pales in comparison to the evil inflicted by the DA. I am following the law. EWE THE SHEEPLE and The Ministerz of Injustice seek to redefine the law by ignoring the fact there is NO MENS REA for POTHEADZ. You proved NOTHING, because people are still busted for POT After my case the jig is up.
10 hours ago · Sent from Web

Mary Thomas-Spears:
ok good luck with your slide show in Court
10 hours ago

Mary Thomas-Spears:  Still don’t have a number and I am being told by everyone around me not to lend my name to any more of your BS just so you know!

#

I received this message from Rev. Mary:

About my calling myself a psychic…
See these posts here https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=859464480858420&id=287554521382755

I don’t have to be psychic to know his games will not work in their Courts because that is their Game!

Just saying… When he hadn’t read the transcripts from Any Of My Cases or Others Whom I have Advocated on behalf of…. He is Clueless as to how I addressed any thing or What We Proved!!!

and it was all recorded as well by voice recorders and video…

So like I said, he is only helping him and tooting his own horn and really he is just tooting his own horn and helping himself to a jail cell in my humble opinion!

 

PLEASE REVIEW THE LINKS BELOW:

 

https://www.facebook.com/thorne.peters/videos/1309776462436029/

https://kentuckymarijuanaparty.com/2017/04/13/is-no-mans-rae-the-plea-to-set-us-free/

https://marythomasspearsblog.wordpress.com/

https://www.facebook.com/marythomas.spears/posts/654968434600555

https://marythomasspearsblog.wordpress.com/2017/04/15/the-most-important-lesson-in-understanding-how-you-are-screwed-by-the-words-used/

https://revmarythomasspears.wordpress.com/2017/04/22/the-why-and-how/

https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=1756126138033609&id=100009087183261&ref=bookmarks&refid=52&__tn__=%2As

https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=1756018908044332&id=100009087183261&ref=m_notif&notif_t=like

SMK

Is No Men’s Rae “The plea to SET US FREE” ?

 

April 13, 2017

The debate over whether or not to use “no mens rae” when facing a Cannabis charge in a Court of Law has been brought to the forefront with Thorne Peters who is facing charges for Marijuana and paraphernalia possession which begins on July 31, 2017 in a Memphis, TN Court of Law.

There is always two sides to every story and multiple opinions, therefore I will attempt to present both opinions that I have been offered, as far as the use of no “mens rae” in a Court of Law.

In the first scenario Thorne Peters feels that no “mens rae” or having no guilty mind at the time the charge was incurred, is of itself enough to render a not guilty verdict if given the chance in a trial by jury.

In the second scenario Rev. Mary Thomas Spears differs in opinion as she states that no “mens rae” plead as a defense from the beginning of a trial is not in anyone’s best interest because this plea is meant to establish the fact the the defendant did not, in fact, know that they were guilty of a crime at the time.  It does not mean that you feel you were not guilty at the time because of your beliefs.

In a Facebook message today, Thorne Peters sent the following to me:

Judge Neil Gorsuch, of Denver, Colorado, a Supreme Court Justice nominee, (now confirmed) defends the lawful right of people using drugs and cannabis, as well as a variety of consensual acts currently prohibited.

In his 2006 book, “Assisted Suicide and the Right to Euthanasia”, Gorsuch claims that people have the right to die, kill themselves or join suicide pacts. He also supports the rights of citizens to use drugs, commit prostitution and even sell their body parts.

“If a person has the right to die, they also have the right to use drugs.”

Gorsuch claims the legal standard of “mens rea” (the guilty mind) does not apply to consensual acts.

In Memphis, since February 2015, CANNABIS Proactivist THORNE PETERS, known as “THE KINGPIN”, has been using a “no mens rea” defense against Possession for sales of CANNABIS charges . . . a case that has been set off for trial on two different occasions and is currently reset for trial in Division 1 on July 31, 2017 . . . 29 months after the arrest.

Judge Paula Skahan explained to Peters that “no mens rea” is a matter for the jury to decide. Peters claims the State is reluctant to go to trial because there are no legal grounds to proceed because he had “no mens rea.”

“When I make my case to the jury at THE TRIAL OF THE MILLENNIUM, I will prove my rights are being violated and we will have the legal mantra to end CANNABIS Prohibition. “NO MENS REA!”

Peters notoriously ran a “420 Friendly Nightclub” in Millington, TN which was closed as a Public Nuisance in 2009. He spent 19 months in jail fighting drug trafficking charges that were dropped. Peters was arrested for toking POT from an apple at the courthouse on 4/20/2011. In 2014, he spent a year dealing POT on Facebook; making YouTube videos that he posted to the walls of the local authorities seeking to be arrested. “The only way to make our case is to make the jury understand there is no mens rea. We must follow the law; not seek to change it.”

Once again Peters will represent himself, only this time he claims his case will represent all of CANNABIS Universe.

“A case for NO MENS REA cannot be defeated in court, because we have no accuser and we have consent. Like it was in the JIM CROW south, we are being violated by political policies enforced with criminal codes that oppress us.”

We will be following this trial till its conclusion, so stay tuned.

---

MOTION TO DISMISS POT BUST

Thorne Peters·Sunday, November 15, 2015

“It is not against the LAW to grow deal and toke POT! It is against an unjust Political Policy known as PROHIBITION, which is as UNCONSTITUTIONAL as JIM CROW!”~ THE KINGPIN THORNE PETERS!
“ILLEGAL v. UNLAWFUL” . . . a distinction with the greatest difference. LINK

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JUDGE PAULA SKAHAN (TN),

“….As far as “Mens Rae”, those are issues for a trial in front of a jury…” 

---

Now comes a differing opinion from Rev. Mary Thomas-Spears and the group of “Americans for Cannabis” which is also a repeal organization.

Mary Thomas-Spears shared Constitutional Cannabis‘s post to the group: Kentucky for Cannabis™.

From another educational page of mine here on FB… –

Constitutional Cannabis

First Lesson to remember in Law is – That despite what you believe all the words mean… That those words are translated back to their Latin Definitions by the Courts = like Doctors

The Judges, Lawyers,… Use Latin Words and Terms to communicate and do their business!

“Where being a good Catholic boy pays off!” ~ Gatewood Galbraith

So your first lesson is? They do not want you to know what they are saying as they hide the true meanings of the words… While they taught you to read a Webster’s Dictionary….

They use Black’s Law Dictionary or West Business Law for the most part.

It is very important to note that both of these Dictionaries quote Cannon Law.

As the Law is an extension of the Law of G-d handed down or Canonized by the Roman Catholic Church and or Mosaic Law.

Just as Government is the extension of, incorporation or Corporation, Corpse = Dead Body of the Administration or Ministry established by the Church for Control and Profit = why the Church is Tax Exempt and why Courtrooms look like churches with pews…

Any questions??? About any of this?

Continuing on…

Bernard Lucas

I have a question for you Mary. I see a number of cannabis activist’s promoting a #NoMensRea (No Guilty Mind) To be used as a cannabis defense when charged with cannabis possession in a court of law. I have not seen any documentation or court cases, or defendants having their cannabis case dismissed by using the plea #NoMensRea? I don’t think activist’s should be promoting this defense when courts may be most likely to ignore this defense? Would you please be able to clear up this possible misconception and set us straight on this defense?

Mary Thomas-Spears

TY! Bernard Lucas for asking a question that I have asked myself, as it is a good question!
The question is #NoMensRea ?
No!!! I do not promote the use of this defense
http://nationalparalegal.edu/public_documents/courseware_asp_files/criminalLaw/basicElements/CommonLawMensRea.asp
Why???
I am not an Attorney so you can not construe this as Legal Advise as I share my understanding from research and experience only.

Making that your Defense is like making an Insanity Defense in my opinion.
Which is nearly impossible for most conscious people to pull off…

Why? It has to be proven or established to at least what?  Cast doubt upon a Jury…
I can see more than one problem with this defense in any Court in any case where it may be proven that the defendant was aware of the Laws in Question? Or the Charges brought before them… Or where they did anything covertly = any attempt to hide what they was doing… Or was not out open and upfront with their actions on….

Why? Because all the Prosecution has to prove at this point is, were you aware of the Law(s) and did you knowingly intend to break the Law = you intended to commit harm upon the State or Feds… As they are claiming to be the victim at this point.
It opens a can of worms that is hard to keep alive in the Courtroom without addressing their unconstitutional over reach… Like their claiming to be the victim!

Common Law Mens Rea

nationalparalegal.edu

 

Bernard Lucas

“Excellent answer Mary. Just as I had thought about it from my research. Kentucky for Cannabis™ and all Americans For Cannabis groups, pages etc. Will not be promoting anything like this defense. Which may send a defendant the wrong message.”

In another post on Facebook Mary states the following in response to a discussion with Thorne Peters,

I CHALLENGE ANYONE ATTACKING ME AND DEFENDING #ThornePeters to document ONE CASE where his Motion for #NoMansRae has ever worked in a Courtroom when filed in the ORDER of Process in which he had ADVISED OTHERS to FILE it .

As I have already stated – IN MY OPINION- THE PROPER ORDER OF LEGAL PROCESS IS,

One friend wrote – “Her point is you have to be Arrested first!”  That isn’t my point at all but it is true.  No and Yes! Yes, you must first be arrested,

No,

HE IS OUT OF ORDER IN THAT  you have to first be willing TO ACCEPT YOUR RESPONSIBILITY FOR WHAT YOU KNOW, =  the current LAW WHICH YOU CHOSE TO BREAK.  You know you chose to break an Unconstitutional Act of Congress!  An Unconstitutional Act that is an Evil Lie! = ADMIT YOUR GUILT = START BY FILING A PLEA OF GUILTY BUT INNOCENT BASED ON A MOTION OF “LESSOR of EVILS” as YOUR DEFENSE  IN ORDER TO ESTABLISH  #NoMansRea. Otherwise you are pleading insanity in these cases.   I am just saying  that they know that you knew you were choosing to break the law = commit evil according to them! The next comment I have later added for clarity fact is – Unless you follow the Order of Process given above how will you be able to prove your case?  Because unless you first admit you knowingly broke an Unconstitutional Law,  how will you ever get to introduce the evidence that it is in fact, an unconstitutional, evil law? You can’t.

Common Law Mens Rea:

Mens rea, or “guilty” intent, deals with what the defendant needs to have been thinking at the time he or she committed the actus reus* for criminal liability to attach. In order to be guilty of most crimes, the defendant must have had the mens rea required for the crime he was committing at the time he committed the criminal act. As with the actus reus, there is no single mens rea that is required for all crimes. Rather, it will be different for each specific crime. LINK

*(ac·tus re·us /ˌaktəs ˈrēəs,ˈrāəs/ noun  / Law noun: actus reus / action or conduct that is a constituent element of a crime, as opposed to the mental state of the accused)

---

Mens Rea:
The state of mind that the prosecution, to secure a conviction, must prove that a defendant had when committing a crime.

---

In conclusion, first of all I do not think it is in anyone’s best interest to go into a Court of Law as a defendant and a defense attorney!  It is not a great idea to represent yourself in any circumstance, especially in trial.  Secondly, I would never try to use No mens rae because I know beyond a shadow of a doubt that the statutes will deem me guilty as charged if I tried to say I did not know marijuana was illegal!  **I definitely know that Marijuana is illegal – according to the statutes which the Government now have in place to regulate commerce – it makes it an offense to the Government that I was using, possessing or giving away Marijuana.  And I KNOW this.

Rather, if I were to pursue a trial by jury I would make a guilty plea and then use a “lesser of two evils” defense.  Because of the fact that I have a disability for which Marijuana is  “the lesser of two evils” versus a strong pharmaceutical pain reliever, I may be able to convince the jury to nullify my verdict.  Mind you that this is just an example but I think it explains the concept.  As Rev. Mary so eloquently explains to me…

**It is all good except where you say you know Marijuana is illegal! You know Gatewood and I already proved that it isn’t.

It is the “trafficking” or possession of a “controlled substance” = not an illegal substance but rather “Controlled“. Controlled by what ? An unconstitutional Act of Congress! That is illegal, not the Substance = you already have a established constitutional right to use marijuana = it is Legal through taxation = the marijuana tax act repealed by Leary = they can’t tax your right to use or possesses!

(What the hell Sheree ? You don’t believe Gatewood ? Or Leary vs the US?? And I respond, of course I know this Mary!  What the hell??  But evidently I must have used the wrong word somewhere, lol)

It is the currency = trafficking = entering the market place That’s controlled!!!

That becomes illegal when you violate the CSA, (Controlled Substance Act), as they are only given authority over Currency, the Market Place and Foreign War and why they can’t tell you what you can consume unless your eating the cash or currency it’s self!

Don’t be misleading by saying you know Marijuana is Illegal because the Constitution is the highest law in the land and according to it it isn’t !

You can say you know that entering the market place = when currency enters in – the trafficking in a “controlled substance” is illegal but not the substance it’s self!

And I respond by saying “Thank you for that clarification, Mary”!

It will be interesting to see how the trial proceeds in July.  I think it goes without saying that we all wish #ThornePeters the best of luck in his endeavor!  I hope that when it’s over Thorne can walk out of the Courtroom a free man and we can all get together and light up a big fat joint and celebrate the fact that we no longer have to feel guilty for breaking the Law to smoke a damn joint!

sk

 

Notes, Links, and definitions of interest:

Mens rea (/ˈmɛnz ˈriːə/; Latin for “guilty mind”^[1][2][3]) is the mental element of a crime. It is a necessary element of many crimes.  The standard common law test of criminal liability is expressed in the Latin phrase actus reus non facit reum nisi mens sit rea, i.e. “the act is not culpable unless the mind is guilty”. In jurisdictions with due process, there must be both actus reus (“guilty act”) and mens rea for a defendant to be guilty of a crime (see concurrence). As a general rule, someone who acted without mental fault is not liable in criminal law. Exceptions are known as strict liability crimes.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Model_Penal_Code#Mens_rea_or_culpability

https://www.facebook.com/thorne.peters/videos/1293329740747368/

http://www.tncourts.gov/sites/default/files/petersthorneopn.pdf

http://wreg.com/2015/02/05/man-known-for-marijuana-advocacy-in-jail-again/

http://www.tsc.state.tn.us/sites/default/files/petersthorneopn.pdf

http://press.princeton.edu/titles/8317.html

https://www.facebook.com/MaryL.Thomas.Spears

https://www.facebook.com/MaryL.Thomas.Spears/posts/1755983124714577

https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=1756018908044332&id=100009087183261&ref=m_notif&notif_t=like